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Fixed disk vs dynamic vs linked to physical ? VS R2 sp1Source: microsoft.public.virtualserver
Sent: 12/10/2007
From: markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
Message:I'm about to embark on virtualizing some of our servers into VMs..
using VS R2.. Curious what the verdict is on best performance.. is
Dynamic really a bad performer after some time, due to fragmentation..
Is fixed the best alternate here or should I consider just dedicated
chunks of a physical drive as linked drives, rather than virtual
drives for the VS's..?
I have a raid 5 array and a raid10 array which i will put 2 VS's on
each one.. i could format parts of each to be virtual drives if this
really is a benefit.
Our user base is 40, but actual load is probably 6-10 at a time for
the sql virtual servers i will make (one role per VS).. ie: Great
Plains Dynamics VS, System Center Config Manager VS, Live Comm Server
2007 VS, etc...
(LCS is one that would probably have 30 at a time, signed in at least)
Thanks for any input on this..
*Also.. is there any reason to install VMM 2007 first, before just
using VS 2005 to create the virtual servers? I will be using this
product in some time..
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Sent: 12/10/2007
From: Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)>
Message:On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 08:39:16 -0800 (PST), markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
wrote:
It can be, really depends on what else is happening on the disk. The
greater number of different apps writing to the disk will increase the
fragmentation much faster.
You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
a linked disk for an extended time.
--
Cheers,
Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVP
http://vpc.essjae.com/
I do not work for Microsoft.
Show quoted text
>I'm about to embark on virtualizing some of our servers into VMs..
>using VS R2.. Curious what the verdict is on best performance.. is
>Dynamic really a bad performer after some time, due to fragmentation..
>
>Is fixed the best alternate here or should I consider just dedicated
>chunks of a physical drive as linked drives, rather than virtual
>drives for the VS's..?
Sent: 12/10/2007
From: markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
Message:On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
So running off the physical disc, rather than a vhd would give even
better performance than a fixed disk vhd i'm assuming?
I'm wondering if it would even matter for a 40 user database like
great plains (6-10 simultaneous).
Show quoted text
> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
> a linked disk for an extended time.
>
> --
Sent: 12/10/2007
From: Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)>
Message:On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:09:07 -0800 (PST), markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
wrote:
Physical to Virtual. Meaning you can only use a linked disk when
you're converting a real server to a virtual one.
Typo, you CANNOT run a VM off a linked disk for an extended time, you
can only do during your conversion process. You can't mount a linked
disk to a VM and use it in place of an expanding or fixed disk.
--
Cheers,
Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVP
http://vpc.essjae.com/
I do not work for Microsoft.
Show quoted text
>On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
>
>> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
>> a linked disk for an extended time.
>>
>> --
>
>Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
Sent: 12/11/2007
From: markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
Message:On Dec 10, 8:36 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
Ah ok.. i follow...
Do you know if you can somehow later on, expand a fixed disk?
Show quoted text
> On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:09:07 -0800 (PST),markm75<(email address - cut out)>
> wrote:
>
> >On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
>
> >> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
> >> a linked disk for an extended time.
>
> >> --
>
> >Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
>
> Physical to Virtual. Meaning you can only use a linked disk when
> you're converting a real server to a virtual one.
>
> Typo, you CANNOT run a VM off a linked disk for an extended time, you
> can only do during your conversion process. You can't mount a linked
> disk to a VM and use it in place of an expanding or fixed disk.
>
> --
> Cheers,
> Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVPhttp://vpc.essjae.com/
> I do not work for Microsoft.
Sent: 12/11/2007
From: Steve Jain
Message:"markm75" wrote:
I think you're confused on teminolgy. Once you create a VHD, either
expanding or fixed, the maximum size cannot be changed. Once you've created
a 40GB VHD, it's always a 40GB drive.
A dynamically expanding disk starts out at about 1-2MB and it expands as
data is written into it, until it reaches either it's maximum capacity
defined when created, or when the physical drive runs out of real disk space,
whichever is the lesser.
A fixed drive is created as a file of the size specified, i.e. 40GB in this
case.
Neither can be expanded without 3rd party tools.
Show quoted text
> On Dec 10, 8:36 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
> > On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:09:07 -0800 (PST),markm75<(email address - cut out)>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
> >
> > >> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
> > >> a linked disk for an extended time.
> >
> > >> --
> >
> > >Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
> >
> > Physical to Virtual. Meaning you can only use a linked disk when
> > you're converting a real server to a virtual one.
> >
> > Typo, you CANNOT run a VM off a linked disk for an extended time, you
> > can only do during your conversion process. You can't mount a linked
> > disk to a VM and use it in place of an expanding or fixed disk.
> >
> > --
> > Cheers,
> > Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVPhttp://vpc.essjae.com/
> > I do not work for Microsoft.
>
> Ah ok.. i follow...
>
> Do you know if you can somehow later on, expand a fixed disk?
>
Sent: 12/11/2007
From: markm75 <(email address - cut out)>
Message:On Dec 11, 4:08 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)am> wrote:
Thats what i kinda expected.. ie: ghost or acronis would be needed to
clone the drive to a new fixed drive if space runs out.
Show quoted text
> "markm75" wrote:
> > On Dec 10, 8:36 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
> > > On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:09:07 -0800 (PST),markm75<(email address - cut out)>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > >On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
>
> > > >> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
> > > >> a linked disk for an extended time.
>
> > > >> --
>
> > > >Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
>
> > > Physical to Virtual. Meaning you can only use a linked disk when
> > > you're converting a real server to a virtual one.
>
> > > Typo, you CANNOT run a VM off a linked disk for an extended time, you
> > > can only do during your conversion process. You can't mount a linked
> > > disk to a VM and use it in place of an expanding or fixed disk.
>
> > > --
> > > Cheers,
> > > Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVPhttp://vpc.essjae.com/
> > > I do not work for Microsoft.
>
> > Ah ok.. i follow...
>
> > Do you know if you can somehow later on, expand a fixed disk?
>
> I think you're confused on teminolgy. Once you create a VHD, either
> expanding or fixed, the maximum size cannot be changed. Once you've created
> a 40GB VHD, it's always a 40GB drive.
> A dynamically expanding disk starts out at about 1-2MB and it expands as
> data is written into it, until it reaches either it's maximum capacity
> defined when created, or when the physical drive runs out of real disk space,
> whichever is the lesser.
> A fixed drive is created as a file of the size specified, i.e. 40GB in this
> case.
>
> Neither can be expanded without 3rd party tools.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Sent: 12/11/2007
From: Steve Jain
Message:"markm75" wrote:
there is also a product called vhd expander or something similar that will
expand a VHD, but I've heard varying reports of it working with boot drives.
Show quoted text
> On Dec 11, 4:08 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)am> wrote:
> > "markm75" wrote:
> > > On Dec 10, 8:36 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 11:09:07 -0800 (PST),markm75<(email address - cut out)>
> > > > wrote:
> >
> > > > >On Dec 10, 2:04 pm, Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)> wrote:
> >
> > > > >> You can use linked disks in VS, except for P2V. You can run a VM off
> > > > >> a linked disk for an extended time.
> >
> > > > >> --
> >
> > > > >Sorry.. what is P2V? By extended time what did you mean..
> >
> > > > Physical to Virtual. Meaning you can only use a linked disk when
> > > > you're converting a real server to a virtual one.
> >
> > > > Typo, you CANNOT run a VM off a linked disk for an extended time, you
> > > > can only do during your conversion process. You can't mount a linked
> > > > disk to a VM and use it in place of an expanding or fixed disk.
> >
> > > > --
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVPhttp://vpc.essjae.com/
> > > > I do not work for Microsoft.
> >
> > > Ah ok.. i follow...
> >
> > > Do you know if you can somehow later on, expand a fixed disk?
> >
> > I think you're confused on teminolgy. Once you create a VHD, either
> > expanding or fixed, the maximum size cannot be changed. Once you've created
> > a 40GB VHD, it's always a 40GB drive.
> > A dynamically expanding disk starts out at about 1-2MB and it expands as
> > data is written into it, until it reaches either it's maximum capacity
> > defined when created, or when the physical drive runs out of real disk space,
> > whichever is the lesser.
> > A fixed drive is created as a file of the size specified, i.e. 40GB in this
> > case.
> >
> > Neither can be expanded without 3rd party tools.- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Thats what i kinda expected.. ie: ghost or acronis would be needed to
> clone the drive to a new fixed drive if space runs out.
>
Sent: 12/21/2007
From: markm75
Message:Here are some results using Performancetest 6.1, on a virtual server 2005 r2
sp1, virtual server, running Enterprise x64 r2 sp2...
Fixed Virtual drive: , NO Virtual Addons installed
Burst: 128.0 MB/sec
Avg read: 62.2 MB/sec (random access 15.4ms)
Seq writes: 18.9 MB/sec
Random seek + rw: 3.27
Fixed Virtual drive: ,WITH Virtual Addons installed
Burst: 160 MB/sec
Avg read: 79.6 MB/sec (random access 14.8ms) (this one is slower than
dynamic below)
Seq writes: 23.8 MB/sec (HIGHER than Dynamic here!)
Random seek + rw: 3.55 (Toss up)
Dynamic Virtual drive C , NO Virtual Addons installed
Burst: 120.5 MB/sec (no change from fixed to dynmic here)
Avg read: 74.6-80.3 (random access 2.5-2.7ms) (avg reads higher on
dynamic, random access lower here too)
Seq writes: 14.5,13.2,15.1 (these appear higher if dynamic)
Random seek + rw: 3.36,3.4
Dynamic Virtual drive C , WITH Virtual Addons installed (reads get alittle
faster)
Burst: 141 MB/sec (still not as fast as the 219 with the virtual STD 2003
VSDC01?!)
Avg read: 112.1 MB/sec (2.1 random access) (still not as fast as the 219
with the virtual STD 2003 VSDC01?!)
Seq writes: 16.4,18.1
Random seek + rw: 3.1
Based on these.. would I be wrong in thinking, contrary to logic, that it
would be a better performer to go with Dynamic disks when I virtualize my
servers?
Any thoughts?
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