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Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity problem

Source: microsoft.public.virtualpc
Sent: 10/12/2004
From: Jason Ward
Message:

I got a weird problem.

Shortly after booting a system I loose IP connectivity between my host
computer and the virtual computer.

However both computers continue to be able to see the network and all other
devices connect to the network and visa versa, but not each other.

Can anyone help?

Thanks
Jason

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Related Messages

RE: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity problem

Sent: 10/12/2004
From: Jason Ward
Message:

Just realised I should perhaps provide more information.

My host OS is Windows XP SP2

My Virtual systems are either

Windows 2003 Standard Edition
Windows 98SE

The Windows 98SE isnt really a problem for me, I only use it to run games
that wont run on XP. However Im a developer and I want to use Virtual Server
2005 to host various things I wont normally be running, but do from time to
time either want to develop against or test.

The PC Ive got is a self built one.
AMD64
1GB Ram
Netgear WG311 wireless network adaptor
Dual Monitor setup (with two video cards)
1 x 160 GB IDE Hardisk
1 x 250 GB SATA IDE Hardisk

Thanks
Jason

"Jason Ward" wrote:

Show quoted text

> I got a weird problem.
>
> Shortly after booting a system I loose IP connectivity between my host
> computer and the virtual computer.
>
> However both computers continue to be able to see the network and all other
> devices connect to the network and visa versa, but not each other.
>
> Can anyone help?
>
> Thanks
> Jason

RE: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity problem

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: "Scott Baker" <(email address - cut out)>
Message:

Virtual Server questions should be posted to the Virtual
Server newsgroup:
microsoft.public.virtualserver

Check your Host for firewall and anti-virus software that
may be causing a problem.

Scott

use it to run games
to use Virtual Server
but do from time to
between my host
network and all other
each other.

Show quoted text

>-----Original Message-----
>Just realised I should perhaps provide more information.
>
>My host OS is Windows XP SP2
>
>My Virtual systems are either
>
>Windows 2003 Standard Edition
>Windows 98SE
>
>The Windows 98SE isnt really a problem for me, I only
>that wont run on XP. However Im a developer and I want
>2005 to host various things I wont normally be running,
>time either want to develop against or test.
>
>The PC Ive got is a self built one.
>AMD64
>1GB Ram
>Netgear WG311 wireless network adaptor
>Dual Monitor setup (with two video cards)
>1 x 160 GB IDE Hardisk
>1 x 250 GB SATA IDE Hardisk
>
>Thanks
>Jason
>
>"Jason Ward" wrote:
>
>> I got a weird problem.
>>
>> Shortly after booting a system I loose IP connectivity
>> computer and the virtual computer.
>>
>> However both computers continue to be able to see the
>> devices connect to the network and visa versa, but not
>>
>> Can anyone help?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Jason
>.
>

RE: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: Jason Ward
Message:

Unfortunatly I have no access to the newsgroup microsoft.public.virtualserver
as MS havent yet put it on their website and I dont have access to news
protocol.

Its not a firewall problem or anti-virus as Ive tested it both with these
enabled and disabled.

Like I say it works for a while, sometimes 10 to 15 minutes before stopping
working, I dont think a firewall or anti-virus would do that.

Jason
:)

"Scott Baker" wrote:

Show quoted text

> Virtual Server questions should be posted to the Virtual
> Server newsgroup:
> microsoft.public.virtualserver
>
> Check your Host for firewall and anti-virus software that
> may be causing a problem.
>
> Scott
>

Re: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: Jason Ward
Message:

OK, Im going to uninstall Zonealarm anyway as its just too intrusive when it
comes to things like Virtual Server. I'll replace with Norton Anti-virus and
just rely on my real world physical firewall to protect me.

Why is my network not 100% compatible? Where can I find where it says that?

The IP address definatly isnt the problem.

MAC address conflict... yeah, you bet there is. Virtual PC and Virtual
Server ALWAYS assign the same MAC address to all my virtuals, which also
happens to be the MAC address of my own PC, Im always amazed when looking at
my firewall status to see several "unique" devices attached all with the same
MAC address. I'll edit it and give everything unique MAC's see if that
effects it.

I'll let ou know here how it goes.

Jason
:)

"pml" wrote:

Show quoted text

> For Virtual PC, the most common culprits are:
> - You have a software firewall (eg Zone Alarm, Black Ice etc) installed on
> the host (or guest?). In some cases, it causes trouble by only being
> installed, even if it's not enabled.
> - The network adapter on the host that the VPC guest is bound to is a
> wireless adapter which is not 100% "VPC" compatible.
> - You have the same IP network (eg 192.168.0.x) on two places at your
> site, which cases confusion (especially for the host).
> - MAC address conflict (if you have copied a "virtual machine" and did not
> remove/change the MAC address).
>
>
>

Re: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: Jason Ward
Message:

Hmmm, so changing the MAC addresses didnt work.

Removing ZoneAlarm (dam thing kept rbooting my PC, had to uninstall whilst
in safe mode) didnt make any difference either.

Disapointing :(

However Ive read elsewhere on here when people are having networking
problems (between host and hosted OS's) that one solution is to install a
loopback connector and have them communicate that way.

Can someone explain to this to me, and what I need to do to make it work?

Thanks
Jason

"pml" wrote:

Show quoted text

> > Why is my network not 100% compatible? Where can I find where it says
> > that?
>
> Search this newgroup. I don't know the internals of the networking, but
> simply speaking WLAN cards that follows standard to 100% does not allow
> spoofing of packets in a way that the host and guest can communicate.
> Remember that VPC acually does both promiscouous sniffing on the network at
> some place (to catch traffic for the guests) as well as MAC spoofing (for
> outgoing traffic - so other devices can separate traffic from the guest from
> traffic from the host), so network adapters or drivers that does not allow
> this will not work with VPC.
>
> > MAC address conflict... yeah, you bet there is. Virtual PC and Virtual
> > Server ALWAYS assign the same MAC address to all my virtuals, which also
> > happens to be the MAC address of my own PC, Im always amazed when looking
> > at
> > my firewall status to see several "unique" devices attached all with the
> > same
> > MAC address. I'll edit it and give everything unique MAC's see if that
> > effects it.
>
> It's not a problem for users that only create and delete guests, but some
> users run into this problem when they *copy* guests (the VMC files, or in
> VPC 5.2, make a registry dump file) rather than moving, eg from one host to
> another host if they have a large number of guests configured and don't want
> to change the paramters manually), and don't explicitly clear out the MAC
> addresses. The MAC addresses in VPC are basically configuration parameters
> and are not bound to hardware the same way MAC addresses on a physical NIC
> is once they are created.
> Also, I guess there is a hypotetical chance that the algorithm that creates
> the MAC addresses in VPC could create a MAC address that could be in use by
> another guest PC on another off-line host.
>
> > I'll let ou know here how it goes.
> >
> > Jason
> > :)
>
> Great! (Note that some of the above may be applicable only to VPC, but I
> assume that VS 2005 have the same base functions as VPC 2004.)

Re: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: "pml" <m1343(a)(email address - cut out)>
Message:

> Its not a firewall problem or anti-virus as Ive tested it both with these

For Virtual PC, the most common culprits are:
- You have a software firewall (eg Zone Alarm, Black Ice etc) installed on
the host (or guest?). In some cases, it causes trouble by only being
installed, even if it's not enabled.
- The network adapter on the host that the VPC guest is bound to is a
wireless adapter which is not 100% "VPC" compatible.
- You have the same IP network (eg 192.168.0.x) on two places at your
site, which cases confusion (especially for the host).
- MAC address conflict (if you have copied a "virtual machine" and did not
remove/change the MAC address).

Show quoted text

> enabled and disabled.
>
> Like I say it works for a while, sometimes 10 to 15 minutes before
> stopping
> working, I dont think a firewall or anti-virus would do that.

Re: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: "pml" <m1343(a)(email address - cut out)>
Message:

> Why is my network not 100% compatible? Where can I find where it says

Search this newgroup. I don't know the internals of the networking, but
simply speaking WLAN cards that follows standard to 100% does not allow
spoofing of packets in a way that the host and guest can communicate.
Remember that VPC acually does both promiscouous sniffing on the network at
some place (to catch traffic for the guests) as well as MAC spoofing (for
outgoing traffic - so other devices can separate traffic from the guest from
traffic from the host), so network adapters or drivers that does not allow
this will not work with VPC.

It's not a problem for users that only create and delete guests, but some
users run into this problem when they *copy* guests (the VMC files, or in
VPC 5.2, make a registry dump file) rather than moving, eg from one host to
another host if they have a large number of guests configured and don't want
to change the paramters manually), and don't explicitly clear out the MAC
addresses. The MAC addresses in VPC are basically configuration parameters
and are not bound to hardware the same way MAC addresses on a physical NIC
is once they are created.
Also, I guess there is a hypotetical chance that the algorithm that creates
the MAC addresses in VPC could create a MAC address that could be in use by
another guest PC on another off-line host.

Great! (Note that some of the above may be applicable only to VPC, but I
assume that VS 2005 have the same base functions as VPC 2004.)

Show quoted text

> that?
> MAC address conflict... yeah, you bet there is. Virtual PC and Virtual
> Server ALWAYS assign the same MAC address to all my virtuals, which also
> happens to be the MAC address of my own PC, Im always amazed when looking
> at
> my firewall status to see several "unique" devices attached all with the
> same
> MAC address. I'll edit it and give everything unique MAC's see if that
> effects it.
> I'll let ou know here how it goes.
>
> Jason
> :)

Re: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity pro

Sent: 10/13/2004
From: Steve Jain <(email address - cut out)>
Message:

There are numerous threads on the newsgroup with loopback info.

There are also instructions in the VPC help for setting up the
loopback adapter.

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 15:05:20 -0700, "Jason Ward"
<(email address - cut out)> wrote:

Steve Jain, Microsoft MVP for Virtual PC for Windows
Website: http://www.essjae.com
*** All posts are provided AS-IS, no warranty, no QoS ***

Show quoted text

>Hmmm, so changing the MAC addresses didnt work.
>
>Removing ZoneAlarm (dam thing kept rbooting my PC, had to uninstall whilst
>in safe mode) didnt make any difference either.
>
>Disapointing :(
>
>However Ive read elsewhere on here when people are having networking
>problems (between host and hosted OS's) that one solution is to install a
>loopback connector and have them communicate that way.
>
>Can someone explain to this to me, and what I need to do to make it work?
>
>Thanks
>Jason
>
>
>"pml" wrote:
>
>> > Why is my network not 100% compatible? Where can I find where it says
>> > that?
>>
>> Search this newgroup. I don't know the internals of the networking, but
>> simply speaking WLAN cards that follows standard to 100% does not allow
>> spoofing of packets in a way that the host and guest can communicate.
>> Remember that VPC acually does both promiscouous sniffing on the network at
>> some place (to catch traffic for the guests) as well as MAC spoofing (for
>> outgoing traffic - so other devices can separate traffic from the guest from
>> traffic from the host), so network adapters or drivers that does not allow
>> this will not work with VPC.
>>
>> > MAC address conflict... yeah, you bet there is. Virtual PC and Virtual
>> > Server ALWAYS assign the same MAC address to all my virtuals, which also
>> > happens to be the MAC address of my own PC, Im always amazed when looking
>> > at
>> > my firewall status to see several "unique" devices attached all with the
>> > same
>> > MAC address. I'll edit it and give everything unique MAC's see if that
>> > effects it.
>>
>> It's not a problem for users that only create and delete guests, but some
>> users run into this problem when they *copy* guests (the VMC files, or in
>> VPC 5.2, make a registry dump file) rather than moving, eg from one host to
>> another host if they have a large number of guests configured and don't want
>> to change the paramters manually), and don't explicitly clear out the MAC
>> addresses. The MAC addresses in VPC are basically configuration parameters
>> and are not bound to hardware the same way MAC addresses on a physical NIC
>> is once they are created.
>> Also, I guess there is a hypotetical chance that the algorithm that creates
>> the MAC addresses in VPC could create a MAC address that could be in use by
>> another guest PC on another off-line host.
>>
>> > I'll let ou know here how it goes.
>> >
>> > Jason
>> > :)
>>
>> Great! (Note that some of the above may be applicable only to VPC, but I
>> assume that VS 2005 have the same base functions as VPC 2004.)

RE: Virtual Server 2005 & Virtual PC 2004 network connectivity problem

Sent: 12/18/2005
From: Deniz Miscioglu
Message:

Hi,

I am experiencing exactly the same problem.

I start my guest, network comm. btw. host & guest is fine.
But after 10-30 seconds they can not communicate with each other, but both
can access the gateway and internet.

Guest is set to use the host's wireless network adapter directly, without
NAT. Guest in win2003sp1 host is winXPsp2, VPCsp1.

Please feedback if you could sort this out...

Deniz MISCIOGLU

"Jason Ward" wrote:

Show quoted text

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